Siege Perilous: In Conversation with Thou’s Andy Gibbs & Bryan Funck

Oscillating between unbridled menace and emotive force, Thou are all about the juxtaposition. Also masters of paradox, while the latter facet could be considered lost in the modern age, whichever way you cut it, Thou are prodigies of obscurity.

The story of Thou began in 2005, formed in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, by guitarists Andy Gibbs and Matthew Thudium, bassist Mitch Wells and drummer Terry Gulino, with the band later joined by vocalist, Bryan Funck.

With Gibbs, Thudium, Wells and Funck now joined by guitarist/vocalist KC Stafford and drummer Tyler Coburn, Thou have spent the last three decades shape-shifting through the terrains of punk and hardcore (Peasant, Tyrant, Summit) to the humid marshlands of sludge (Heathen and Magus) and everything in between (collaborations with The Body, Ragana, Emma Ruth Rundle and Mizmor, a slew and compilations, and the wonderful EP trilogy, The House Primordial, Inconsolable and Rhea Sylvia).

Thou’s journey has seen them open the kind of reality tunnel that is equally frightening and transcendental. A furnace-like wall of sound that commands undivided attention. Thematically and sonically, it could all crumble under the weight of despair at any moment.

Umbilical is the next chapter in this gruelling story, which sees the band barrelling into the abyss. Everyone is fair game. None more so than Thou themselves, who deliver a withering document of self-assessment. Listening back to Endurance We Conquer from the band’s 2010 release Summit, and the themes feel close to those that dominate Umbilical. A sense of grappling with the reality of getting older.

Speaking to Gibbs and Funck over Zoom in the lead up to the release of Umbilical, I ask them whether the record is a response to a younger version of the band? “It’s more of the younger version’s response to the current version of the band,” says Funck. “In a very literal, direct sense. It is literally a record being highly self-critical of the band, specifically myself, and just how we handle ourselves, internally and externally.”

“It’s like an indictment,” adds Gibbs. Whilst a burning topic at the turn of the century, the term selling out isn’t one you’d normally associate across the dark frontiers Thou have explored since their inception. Even for underground bands to entertain the notion in 2024, the window is so small that it’s almost mythical. “The word doesn’t appear on the lyric sheet, but you could get the sentiment of that,” says Gibbs.

“You could definitely get the sense that I’m not particularly happy with all the compromises I feel like we’ve made,” adds Funck.

“Not only didn’t we sell out, we didn’t get anything from it,” laughs Gibbs. It’s a case of idealism being eroded by the morbid reality of a new world. One where art has been crushed by capitalism, and making ends meet as an artist is exclusive to the chosen few. This is Thou’s existential burden, but unlike every other band on the planet, they turn the tables by questioning their own motives. It’s quintessential Thou.

At its core, Umbilical is all grit and guile. A malevolent tirade where Funck takes charges, mirthlessly emitting the dark recesses from his soul. It sees Thou at their blistering best.

Starting with Narcissist’s Prayer. A wave of droning guitars that obliterate the surge barriers. Funck laments about the very same compromised ideals spoken of during our conversation. So too abandoned friendships, ending the song as ruthlessly as it begins (“It’s time to die. So die”).

This rolling hellstorm continues with Emotional Terrorist (“Everything I’ve felt is a chain around my neck“) and Lonely Vigil. Vignettes nestled in nihilism, while House of Ideas (ft. Uniform’s Mike Berdan) and I Feel Nothing When You Cry blaze with the kind malicious dread that is like fuel to the fire of your worst nightmares (“I am a rock in a sea of chaos”).

The backend of Umbilical sees Thou casting their barbed net of destruction further afield. The Promise is the band’s searing take on groove metal, while Panic Stricken, I Flee rips and tears with frightening vigour. Ending with Siege Perilous, the band take the sludgy remnants of Heathen and Magus and hurl them into the circle pits of hardcore.

Thematically ruthless and sonically strident, Umbilical is one of year’s best records, reaffirming Thou’s position as one of the most crucial voices across the esoteric landscape.

Having spent an hour talking to Gibbs and Funck, and again, those juxtapositions spring to mind. Gibbs, quietly spoken and zen-like; Funck unflinching and direct. Both cordial and easy going, but equally steadfast to the Thou cause. Our conversation ends on the topic of their current New Orleans base and its music scene.

“The thing about New Orleans, specifically the punk scene, it’s full of people who aren’t from here,” says Funck. “They come down here with an outside concept of things and an outside attitude…  there’s always a sort of tension. I feel like that’s probably where a lot of the issues come from. I’ve put on punk shows for so many years, and thinking back to who the regulars were at the shows, it was mostly people from here.”

Gibbs offers his own take.

“I think that one of the factors that comes into play whenever you have a place like this is that people latch on to the obvious cultural markers but not the deeper understanding,” he says. “When they move here, they approach it as blank slate. That’s where that tension comes, because they don’t have an understanding of where people are coming from down here. It’s a bit of a plague on the city, not just in terms of gentrification, but like a cultural gentrification.”

Gibbs continues to explain the inner-workings of the DIY scene, where people have brought their influences from elsewhere, resulting in an odd hybridisation. “People coming down here with brass band music, but not the brass band music of New Orleans, and then melding that with the existing brass band music that’s here,” he says. “Sometimes it results in some interesting products, but a lot of the time, it just feels like a lot of people coming down here to cosplay.”

Not that any of this directly affects Thou. A band who have spent an existence forging their own path, navigating through the world at their own pace, in their own way.

Sun 13: Recently I got talking to a hardcore kid who was branching out and I recommended Thou. He asked me what the band was like, and I couldn’t really give him a succinct answer. From the artwork to aesthetics of each album, do you see Thou as something mystical?

Andy Gibbs: “I don’t know if it’s mystical. I think that to someone that hasn’t somewhat meticulously followed our career, I think we could come across as confusing. Or certainly pretentious. Like, ‘Okay, here’s our new full length, digest that for two years. Here’s another full length, digest that’. Or with a clear social media presence, ‘Here’s what we look like’. We don’t do all that, so I think that’s what makes it hard for people who aren’t super invested in our band and what makes them perceive us as mystical.

“For the diehards, the few 100 of them that are following and are getting the breadcrumbs that we’re dropping along the way, I think it’s a lot less mystical. In fact, I would say we’re one of the least mystical bands, because we give people a lot of information. But I feel like you got to dig a little bit for it.”

Bryan Funck: “We probably don’t make it easy by constantly contradicting ourselves and sarcastically making fun of ourselves and stuff we like. Especially with the way people consume internet culture now… that kind of humour and the nuance that you pick up a little bit more if you talk to some person… it’s just not there for a lot of people if we put stuff out on the internet and expect people to understand it.”

AG: “Yeah, I think people really like when things are very literal. Immediate media literacy is not exactly at an all-time high right now, so like Brian’s saying, people are prone to not understand what we’re getting at or take it in a way that we don’t intend.”

S13: Seeing Thou at Supersonic in 2022, and it struck me how nonchalant and humorous you were with each other in between songs. Do you think that side of band is lost on some people?

AG: “I think so. Well, maybe it’s not lost that we’re trying to be funny. I think maybe it is funny. (laughs) The way we are onstage, that’s just an enhanced version of how we are at practice. That’s just what happens.”

BF: “It also goes back to what you’re saying about the presentation of the music and the art. People do want it to be fairly literal and they want it to fit in a box that they can consume or understand. I think that the juxtaposition between the seriousness of the music we’re playing and the art we’re presenting versus our personalities when you’re interacting with us is super different.

“For me, we’re not going to get up on stage or have a conversation with a person and put on a persona to fit the music. I don’t think any of us are interested in that. To me, it would just feel super fake. Maybe if I had a different concept of how you’re supposed to be as an artist, it’d be a little different. Coming from punk, that just seems silly to me to… where it makes sense with the context of what we’re presenting.”

AG: “That is what people would want, I think. We would probably be a much more successful band if we came out and had this persona that matched the aesthetics of the music and we were like, ‘This is a song about our pain and struggle’. In the metal world, I think that’s what people tend to want. They really love it. They want a slow sludgy band to come onstage, smoke weed and be this thing. When we don’t do that, it’s confusing to them.”

S13: Can you tell us about the writing process of Umbilical?

AG: “It was an arduous process. We basically started writing songs in 2019 or maybe even 2020. Obviously, the pandemic put a pin in how productive we could really be. There was a performance we did, a live in the studio thing where we got together played some of the songs for Adult Swim, and that was another notch in the belt towards getting the songs in a place where they could be recorded. That was four or five songs. We kept doing stuff, but we also took a detour to do the record with Mizmor [2002’s Myopia – Gilead Media], which took a long time. And then we had random shows and one-off commitments that stalled our progress.

“Finishing this record was really done over a few months in 2023. We had many demos, many reworkings of songs. Usually we’d go in, we’d write the songs, rehearse them to where they’re playable, go into the studio and record them, wait six months then tour.”

BF: “We’d be sick of playing them at that point.” 

AG: “We’d start playing newer songs on tour. That’s how we usually would do this. But this one… it took a lot longer because of pandemic and other commitments, and because of figuring out what we wanted to do with the record and trying to get it aligned with this vision we had for it.”

BF: “We had the Norco soundtrack, too. That sidetracked this for a couple months.”

AG: “Yeah. Just a lot of different projects that would take us away from working on this record which, I guess, ultimately was good. Because I think some of what we ended up doing was influenced by these other projects, like the Mizmor thing. That helped to inform a little bit of the direction of this record.”

BF: “It’s kind of ironic, because this record was supposed to be a lot more like shooting from the hip… kind of bonehead stuff, and we ended up spending a lot more time than we normally would. We normally don’t demo stuff before we record it, but the practicing and writing sessions were so spread out that it made sense to go to the studio with James Whitten. The studio we use, High Tower, is down the hall from our practice space, so it made more sense when we finished a writing session to run down there if he had a night open and bang out quick demos of everything. Just so we had a good demo to fall back on.”

AG: “So we remembered it, too. Because we wouldn’t practice for another couple of months, we’d forget what we even did, and we had to re-teach the parts to everyone.”

BF: “We also had grand designs [of] doing more studio experimentation, which we ended up not really doing quite as much as we originally talked about. The demo was going to be a part of that, but it tended to be more practical than artful.”

S13: What was the one key aspect that you wanted to capture with the record?

BF: “Mostly, the energy. We’re trying to bring together another group of songs. We have certain sets. We’ll play a show where we might just do slower or more melodic stuff. We have a knuckle dragger set where we’re playing more of the rockier stuff. We don’t have a ton of music that fits – maybe a set’s worth of stuff – so part of it was having more material that had a little bit more energy to it, in terms of sonically.”

AG: “I think it was important, too, that when sitting down and trying to write some of the music, [it] was like, ‘What haven’t we done that still fits in that realm?’ Even down to note choices or song structure, maintaining a balance between classic Thou and rocky adjacent Thou stuff, and branching into some different territory. I think the record ended up being a little more on the conservative side in terms of that balance. I don’t feel like there’s too much that goes in a totally new direction, but there’s a little bit of it there. That’s how we usually do things. We have an idea, and then it gets reined back towards where it fits our usual [thing].”

S13: From the sludge-orientated, atmospheric aspects of Magus and Heathen, did it feel like re-visiting the more direct approach of your earlier records was better suited to the themes that underpin Umbilical?

AG: “Yeah, 100 per cent. At least musically, I was consciously not doing a bunch of big open chords, and purposely not doing stuff that was emotional sounding. In the very beginning, we would just play a simple riff for a long period of time, and that’s something that we consciously got away from later. Now going back to some of that more straightforward stuff was definitely a conscious choice.”

BF: “For me lyrically, I sort of centred things on youthful ideology. I think for this record, sonically, it’s the closest we’re going to get to a hardcore record, or something approaching a hardcore record. It fit perfectly for me, because I was going back to ideas about the world and art and how to make a living from a viewpoint of a younger man. I think musically, this is a step more towards the stuff I listened to as a younger man versus what I’m listening to now or what the band has traditionally played.

“Although Andy’s right – I think there is a throwback to stuff we did earlier on, but I feel like we dipped into this stuff and dipped out pretty quick. Right around Peasant era, which is kind of what it sounds like. Where it fits the idea of Thou: riff-y and energetic, but before we got subsumed with the post-metal and post-rock stuff.”

AG: “That’s interesting, because when I say older stuff, that’s really the era I’m thinking of. If you listen to Tyrant, it’s super melodic. There’s lots of spacey leads. It’s melodic in a different way that we never really revisited, and that I don’t think I’d want to necessarily revisit but definitely the Peasant era stuff, and the stuff that was recorded not on the record… the singles from that time.”

BF: “Definitely. It feels like the stuff we were writing when I first joined Thou. The first couple of years I was in the band, [that’s] where the stuff we were writing was going.”

S13: On Narcissist’s Prayer, you’re singing about compromised ideals, abandoned friendships and meandering principals, which got me thinking about people’s behaviour in the modern age. How much do you think technology has played a part in how people interact with each other compared to, say, 20 or 30 years ago? Was this something you were thinking about?

BF: “It wasn’t something that was in the forefront of my mind when we were writing the record, but it’s absolutely something I’ve been thinking about very recently. I go back and forth with that, because it’s so polarising. I feel on the one hand, people will just say whatever the fuck they want, because it feels like there’s no repercussions because of the anonymity of being behind the screen. But on the other hand, with accountability culture, so-called cancel culture, you misstep or say the wrong thing and everybody’s after you. It’s so strange to me, because it’s almost total lawlessness and there’s no responsibility, but then it’s total accountability where people are very much aware of what you’re saying and doing.”

AG: “I think the big difference in the internet age is the motivation that people have for saying what they say. I think there are a lot of people that will say whatever’s on their mind. But I think both the speaking what’s on your mind and the reacting to what other people say, you’re always aware that you’re being perceived in these interactions, so you’re hyper aware that everyone is potentially going to be seeing what you’re saying. I think that leads people to sometimes either self-censor, or to say things they don’t really believe, purely for engagement.

“I think that’s the big difference in the way that communication has changed, the surveillance aspect. Constantly monitoring what everyone else is saying and you’re almost required to have an opinion on what everyone else is saying, whether it’s good or bad. The constant evaluating of each statement to see whether it’s in the good box or the bad box has really fractured a lot of people’s communication skills. And that goes right back to what we were talking about with people needing literal interpretations of things. That nuance is lost when you’re supposed to stamp it good or stamp it bad when you’re reading someone’s opinion.”

BF: “The internet culture, it’s a different reality, and one that you don’t necessarily even have to partake in. (laughs) I think that’s the strange thing for me today… a certain generation’s emphasis on needing to participate in internet culture. Even people who annoy me on the internet. Andy annoys me on the internet! But if I hang out with Andy in real life, it’s a different experience.”

AG: “I’m not giving you my opinion on everything every second that we hang out.”

BF: “But also, it’s like you’re saying, there’s a lot of virtue signaling. People who have very strong opinions this way or that way that they express on the internet…. you talk to them in real life, and it’s not like you’re dealing with a closed-minded maniac. People can have different opinions about things and still interact in a very courteous and respectful, friendly way.”

S13: How important is it for the band to maintain the production continuity with James Whitten?

AG: “It’s twofold. On the one hand, it’s extremely helpful and convenient to have someone who knows what we’re going for right off the bat. We don’t have to hold his hand through any of it, and he’ll intuit some of the stuff we need. We’ve been on this journey together, so we’re both improving our skills in the studio alongside one another. You can hear that in the recordings as they’ve got better in quality and closer to what we want them to be as artists. It’s hard, because you do so many records with the same person… sometimes you worry that it’s going to all sound a little samey. But I think that James is someone who’s been evolving his practice in the same way that we’ve been evolving our practice. I think that keeps it from getting too stale.”

S13: How much of a direct influence does he have? Is he pushing you to go to different places?

AG: “He definitely has a large influence on the final product. As we’re recording in the studio, though, we basically are doing what we want and he’s accommodating. When it gets to the mixing, we give him a wide berth to make decisions about panning or adding a guitar here, where to place the guitars, adding effects to various things. He sometimes goes crazy with it, and we have to rein him in, but I trust him to do all that. I’ll listen to the mix and say, ‘Yes, this is good’ or, ‘No take this insane phaser effect off my guitar’. It’s definitely collaborative.”

BF: “He’ll have a bit of input when it comes to the overdubs. He might have ideas every once in a while, but he’s pretty hands off on trying to get us to do too much. He mainly wants to capture the thing that we’re trying to bring in as accurately as possible, and then push it as far as he can, in terms of the mixing and the effects. That’s where he puts his thumbprint on it. We basically get in there and record everything, and then he’ll take a first pass at the mix. Traditionally, his first pass is pretty close to what we’re going for. He’s big on the prep work and having a conversation with us beforehand… to know how we want the record to sound, and then putting in the work to get the sounds in place as we record, just so that there’s not some weird issues at the end.”

S13: You’ve been together for so long now. Is there a creative tension in the band and, if so, does it make it all better?

AG: “That’s a big question. The creative tension has shifted throughout the years. The big change has been the more and more as we’ve gone on, everyone’s opinion has been given more weight. On the music side, Matthew and I would almost have the final say on whether something stays in a song or not. Now everyone has a voice to say what parts should be in the song, which does create tension. (laughs)

“I think the biggest evidence that it’s a good thing is that between this record and some of the stuff previously, I think the songwriting and the song structure more specifically, is way tighter. There’s very little filler. Even though we all tend to have differing opinions, when it comes to arrangement and songwriting, I think we’ve all worked at trimming the fat a little bit and getting really effective song structures. I think that’s been a positive improvement.

“I’ve been writing most of the music for the past couple albums or, not even albums, but just the past couple of things we’ve done. I could always improve taking creative feedback; that’s a challenge. When you sit down and write a song, it’s easy to get attached to the way you write it. Having to humble myself a little bit and listen to the opinions of everyone else is always a challenge, so there’s definitely tension there. But I think the end result does come out better from everyone having an opinion.”

BF: “When I joined the band, the way the writing would work is that Andy would have a song that he’d bring the practice, ‘Here’s a song, you play this, you play that, you do this’. Or Matthew would have the song, same thing. Or Andy would have half a song, Matthew would have half a song, and somehow, magically, they’d fit. Over the years, by virtue of us not wanting to repeat ourselves, that writing at home that Andy and Matthew did, there was more self-editing. Rather than come up with a song, they might come up with five songs, and only one of them met the new standard. We’re not even hearing all the stuff that they’re working on, so there’s a little bit more attachment to what they’re bringing to practice.

“I’m sure it’s less than optimal when they bring us a song to practice and all of us are like, ‘This riif is cool, this riff sucks, let’s change it’. I’m sure that’s a nightmare to hear after they’ve already gone through the editing process themselves at home.”

S13: It’s interesting that you talk about the half songs because straight away I think of Elimination Rhetoric with so much going on and so many shifts…

AG: “That’s’ funny. I think that song is all Matthew. [He] will often have songs where there are some abrupt changes in feel. I think it’s interesting because I think some of the ones that we wrote half of, back in the day around Peasant era, flow better than some of the songs we’ve written on our own. It just happened to be that way, like a magical occurrence.”

S13: With a song like Unbidden Guest, it struck me just how poetic Bryan’s lyrics have become. Is that something that’s been directed at the songwriting before?

BF: “I’ve definitely shifted the way I’ve been writing lyrics, probably since Rhea Sylvia. Almost all the songs on there, Matthew wrote the lyrics for, and his approach to writing lyrics is very traditional pop, rock style. I don’t know why, but it took me years before I even thought of this band in those terms. Now, I really like the idea of writing like that, so for this record, I tried a lot more to write in that style and get away from the angsty teen diary, or esoteric disillusion manifesto style writing that I would maybe normally do.

“In terms of the structure, all the artifice in terms the lyrics or the imagery, that’s just how I write, because I can’t write a straightforward song. I wish I could write in a way where it clearly had a message and a point but was delivered in a clever and interesting way. I could write a song that clearly says something and is earnest, but it’s not going to be good. (laughs) I have to obfuscate a little bit or shift the angle.

“Umbilical’s essentially almost like a mission statement for the band, or us as people. What I want things to be, but I can’t just write that. I have to write it in a way of, ‘There’s this thing that I would like us to be, but here’s me talking about how we’re failing at this thing. Let me point out all the failures and be focused on the critique. But then let me also critique it in a way where I’m not so clear about the particulars’. It’s a little bit more up for interpretation.”

S13: Going back to your knuckle dragger set, Thou have explored on themes of class and power struggle. Is it frustrating that your message may be lost to some who engage with your music?

AG: “That is frustrating. But I think the other thing about it is contradictory… just like everything with us. On the one hand, it’s like, ‘This isn’t for you, fuck you’. But on the other hand, we are making something sonically that is seemingly for those people. I understand why those people would be into our band without grasping any of the subtext. I can even see how some people can misinterpret it if they’re not really paying attention. That’s what’s interesting, that contradiction, ‘Yes, come on in, here’s your heavy riffs. But also, fuck you for doing that, because you don’t get it and it isn’t for you’. More classic Thou contradictions.”

BF: “Yeah, it’s like when people ask me what I want our shows to be like, because I’m notorious for complaining about the lack of energy sometimes at our shows. I would love for our shows to be super energetic, but I don’t want a bunch of hardcore karate fighting or slam dancing or bush pits. I want a very specific show. Tight, but a lot of movement, but not too violent, but not too tame. It’s got to be pretty energetic, teetering on violence. But also, it has to be an audience full of people who I like and respect and can identify.”

S13: How many times would a show hit that frequency?

BF: “Never. (laughs) Look, we’ve had plenty of shows that are real fun and real raucous, and I’ve had a great time. That’s the thing… when you’ve had a taste of that you know it’s possible. When you get the other thing the rest of the time, it’s a little frustrating. For me specifically, as much of a loudmouth as I am, I don’t like attention. Already doing the show is a little bit uncomfortable, so I need a little bit of give and take from the audience in order to help me have a good time playing.”

S13: You both live in New Orleans having formed the band in Baton Rouge. How much of an influence is Louisiana and your immediate surroundings?

AG: “I don’t think that the Louisiana that most people know is an influence at all. What’s inspiring about living here is the people I know… the ties to my childhood and family. I think that how dysfunctional this place is inherently influences everyone that lives here and really exemplifies larger problems in America until it almost blows it up to a comedic degree. Those things to me are influential.

“This is the only place I would want to live until we can’t anymore. Neither of us are going to identify with like, ‘The sludgy swamp back waters influence our slow sludgy riffs, and the mysteries of the swamp, and the gator’. None of that. It’s not even a consideration. It’s funny, too, because I think all the bands that people project that onto, like Crowbar or Eyehategod, didn’t even grow up in the swamp. They grew up in the suburbs! It’s just an easy thing for people to connect. ‘Oh, New Orleans is laid back’. It doesn’t feel very laid back to me. In a lot of ways, it’s got an anxious energy.”

BF: “I think if anything, it’s the culture. Especially the punk and DIY culture, and how difficult it is to succeed or get any support down here for most things. The constant frustrations and apathy. That’s probably had the biggest impact on us, specifically in terms of pushing us out of the city to do other things and not focus on local success or notoriety. To just forget about that and leave and go about our business. Also being able to do things creatively in spite of all that, you’ve got to shift your focus. You can’t be worried about people around here giving a shit about anything you do or say. They don’t care.”

AG: “I think something that we’ve always had is a sort of underdog status. Not exactly an ‘us versus the world’ mentality, but at least in terms of the people that are in my social circles, I feel like that’s very much a sentiment of committing to being down here. Like Brian said, doing things despite the limitations, us being from Louisiana and going out into the world and doing what we’re doing, part of our kind of ‘fuck you’ nature is probably rooted in some of that same stuff. I feel like it’s ingrained with a lot of people down here.

“I do feel like South Louisiana is a different world than the rest of America in a lot of ways. Culturally, and just the way that people are. It’s funny because as much as I have complained about the place that I’ve lived, whether it’s here or Baton Rouge, I really have a deep love of South Louisiana and feel very strongly and proud to be from down here. It’s a giant part of my identity, just not in the way that I think people outside of Louisiana would necessarily identify. They just get the obvious pop cultural markers, but I think pride seeps through some of this stuff. It’s just not pride in the same way.”

BF: “I think personality wise, too, it’s had an impact. In terms of how we interact with people in the world… that irreverence in absurdness that I think we apply to how the band is like. That’s definitely a New Orleans thing. Probably a Louisiana thing. That uber familiarity with things and people and lackadaisical attitude about stuff. I think a lot of people in the world just don’t understand it. For us when we find another band or person or group of people that shares that same sensibility, it feels like a diamond in the rough. It’s hard to find those people out in the world because, culturally, I think a lot of people in other cities just don’t interact like that.”

AG: “The way other people interact socially is very impersonal to me. The way that we move through the world is just a very casual and straightforward kind of way. We meet people, and instantly we’re talking to them. That’s how my dad is, that’s how my grandparents were, you know?”

Umbilical is out now via Sacred Bones. Purchase from Bandcamp.